Church of Wells/YMBBA Ministries



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9/14/2013 1:03 pm  #21


Re: A baby dies - what happened?

wellstx wrote:

tc7665 wrote:

speaking on Daniel.. not to sway conversation against baby Faith.. but i have a question. 
Being as there are no children old enough in the church to have had this happen yet.. but soon.. the time will come.  What happens when one day your child walks up to you and says "dad, i have been asking the Lord to guide me.. and He has shown me that the things our elders speak are evil...."
Being as you have 2 girls.. and girls arent allowed to speak to the men regarding the Lord.. lets just use your son as an example... what happens then?  do you cast out your own son?  how are your elders planning to deal with that?  how are YOU prepared to deal with that? 

 These people don't believe that the woman are smart enough to talk to the men about the Lord? I'm being serious.  Is this how it really works?

i don't know their explanation.. i doubt that it has anything to do with smarts or education.. but more of placehead.. God, man, woman, child.. so woman can teach the children... but not the man.  i know in the audio placed on the CoW homepage.. they mention that they told mr. grove numerous time that they would discuss salvation with him only and that they were kind in not rebuking mrs. grove when she addressed them; men on the ways of the Lord and that it was not her place.

9/14/2013 2:02 pm  #22


Re: A baby dies - what happened?

One thing I know for sure is that the brainwashing begins way before they show up at COW. Little jabs here and there creating doubt about their salvation. I know my child was worked on for over a year and a half prior to his departure. No one who wasn't brainwashed would act as they do. I don't believe they know everything before they commit and once committed they are trapped by fear. Completely not what God intended when He sacrificed his Son. But I agree with Kjdean49...God IS bigger than this and He is sovereign and just. The elders are not beyond reproach and God will deal with their hypocrisy!!!

9/16/2013 7:28 pm  #23


Re: A baby dies - what happened?

Kjdean49 wrote:

Thanks everyone. Tc, it is a 26 yr old woman and she did make a choice. Just like my daughter made a choice. And Dan. As well as the young women who made the choice to marry the men that God gave the elders the "word" that the marriage should take place. Because fear is so deeply instilled in them they are terrified to go against what the elders say. I've HEARD the anguish in the mother's voice saying her daughter does not love the man she is married to. I HEARD the hopelessness in Kelly's voice in her testimony saying "Kristin, you are right. There is no place else to turn." 

I guess my biggest issue is the lack of accountability for Faith's death. Everyone talks all around it. But this one fact remains...they stood around her while she drew her last breath. I have the recording of Ryan telling a family member how she turned blue and stopped breathing. AND THEY DID NOTHING!!! No way can you justify that. No way. 

Let me assure you all of this one thing. No matter how dark it seems or how great the sorrow and grief become, God is still good. He is bigger than all of this. And, someday, justice will be served.

As I have said before, my heart breaks for you. I hope that justice is served on the leaders of this group on this earth, but I am sure that, if not on this earth, it will be served later.

I have watched recent discussion surrounding CoW and I cannot agree with those who argue that the CoW leaders are "godly" "misled but well-meaning" "just wanting to see others follow Christ" etc. etc. I would suggest that the leaders are quintessential narcissists, and that, yes, they are evil and UNgodly. There is also something truly wrong with their attitudes toward women. But to cause the death of a newborn infant...

I also think that light needs to be shed on their relationship with local law enforcement. Something is not right there.

9/16/2013 8:07 pm  #24


Re: A baby dies - what happened?

apple1 wrote:

 I cannot agree with those who argue that the CoW leaders are "godly" "misled but well-meaning" "just wanting to see others follow Christ" etc. etc. I would suggest that the leaders are quintessential narcissists, and that, yes, they are evil and UNgodly. There is also something truly wrong with their attitudes toward women. But to cause the death of a newborn infant...

I also think that light needs to be shed on their relationship with local law enforcement. Something is not right there.

Completely agree. I don't see any altruism or good intentions in there at all.

Law enforcement. That's another story. Previously I thought there must be some good ol' boy thing happening and looking the other way. I've reconsidered. It's not really possible in this day and age. So there's pieces the public simply can't know.
 

9/22/2013 6:22 pm  #25


Re: A baby dies - what happened?

So nobody wants to talk about what happened? The 'why' and 'how' it happened?

The Church of Wells doesn't want to discuss it, so nobody will? Why? Because it's too personal? Because the parents need privacy? Because it's too uncomfortable?

Or because nobody believes it? Has everyone already decided it must not have happened this way? Maybe everyone thinks this has been overdramatized and the parents did the best they could? That even if she had had a routine new baby exam by an experienced midwife and the stenosis been discovered, or had been taken to an ER for medical intervention later, that she would have died anyway? 

No, it's just not possible that this normal, intelligent, capable, loving couple who wanted this baby, could have been taking orders from three young men in their twenties (who had no children of their own at the time) who made decisions about this pregnancy long before the birth, huddled around praying and "seeking the Lord" so they could give instructions during the delivery, and then ultimately decided against medical intervention. 
Nope, you're right. That couldn't happen. That truly sounds farfetched. Who would do that?

     Thread Starter

9/22/2013 6:34 pm  #26


Re: A baby dies - what happened?

I think Sean's "message" at the service speaks plainly to the fact they believed she would be resurrected. Guess he was wrong.

10/04/2013 6:13 pm  #27


Re: A baby dies - what happened?

wellstx wrote:

Remember Ashley is Cory's wife, so I'm sure they get to pick and choose their rules.  Also, Ashley's mother is a physician and they have a relationship, so I'm sure she and the child had access to proper medical care.

Of course she did. She had very good prenatal care at a good birthing center in Nacogdoches and a midwife. A perfectly normal healthy pregnancy and delivery.

10/04/2013 7:02 pm  #28


Re: A baby dies - what happened?

Moving here from "Abortion" thread:

tc7665 wrote:

They obviously knew something was wrong as well.. the articles say that she wouldn't eat and daniel tried feeding her with a dropper.. but even that was not successful. 
knowing that there is an Rh factor possibility.. that alone would have scared me enough to seek a dr.

11/03/2013 12:41 am  #29


Re: A baby dies - what happened?

Viewer discretion - profanity, blunt language.

11/07/2013 6:29 pm  #30


Re: A baby dies - what happened?

apple1 wrote:

Kjdean49 wrote:

I guess if this gets to the media it will be ignored.

Unfortunately, it seems that you are correct. See, even in this thread on this board. After your post, in this thread with "a baby dies" in the title, the discussion has turned to financial issues. :-(  Why?

KJDean? I am saddened by the loss of this grandchild and the sorrow it has caused you and your family.  Have you been able to see any of the other children?   Do you know their status?

I cannot understand how they would have presumed that resurrection was the correct pathway.  Even if she had received earlier attention the outcome may have been the same, but to "assume" a miracle of resurrection must have been particularly hard on her parents and your family.  My condolences and prayers for emotional healing and protection from bitterness.


Heb 4:12

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