Church of Wells/YMBBA Ministries

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1/26/2015 4:55 am  #21

Re: What they said...


1/26/2015 1:08 pm  #22

Re: What they said...

Link doesn't work...I wonder if they took it down?


1/26/2015 4:28 pm  #23

Re: What they said...

A Fearful Dinner
Jacob Gardner 

(Abbreviated for length.)

First 11 minutes are long preliminary prayer. 

If there's anyone that should fear in this entire nation, it's you. {A little voice in the background: "Me?"} If anyone should...tremble...fear...exceedingly quake, it's you, brethren. {He sounds genuinely angry} 

All honesty...true to my own conscience, I don't know of another ...that is endeavouring to do what we're doing. It's's the path that we have set our hand...our compass to walk. I know of one other church in the world that I ever percieved, in truth, with us, this generation...had a similar endeavour. God has horrifically judged them. The only reason that He's not judging us in the same ways as he has judged them is because someone's fearing. In this place. Some ones are fearing, in this place. Someone is interceding. Someone's praying. If I had such wisdom and utterance to declare to you the awesomeness of The Presence of God that you are in, right now. You would stand up. You would jump to your feet, in fear. You would say, how dreadful is this place. This is none other than the House of God. How dreadful is this place. If I could paint it with such colors as The Spirit of God only can paint, in your soul envisions. Revelations of the Spirit. It'd never be the same. You wouldn't speak foolishly before the angel of the Lord.

Preached a sermon nearly two years ago, called "A Fearful Dinner." I feel expressly led to preach that same sermon, again. It's a sermon, "A Fearful Dinner." 
...I want way of introduction to the sermon...just do somewhat of a quick teaching. ...word study...on this word 'dinner'. The word supper is well in the scriptures. This word dinner...derivative thereof, dinner, dined, dine, is used approximately 8 times in the entire Bible. {Really? 8 times. Huh} The word supper is used approximately 18 times in the entire Bible or derivative thereof. Supper, supped. {Midday meal, etc etc etc. Making a distinction between times of meals and names referring to specific times. Several scripture references.}  John 21 verse 4. So at noon, in the morning. {Another scripture passage, delineating between dinner and supper}  Luke, chapter 14. Look at verse 12....verse 4. 'When thou makest a dinner'. Or, a supper. He makes a difference right there, between dinner and supper. {Jake is pretty insistent that this means two different meals. Where's he going with this?} So he clearly makes a difference. There are two principle meals among the Jewish culture. It's the morning and it's the evening. Or mid-day and evening. Exodus 16, verse 8. When Christ...when God is speaking to the Children of Israel, fresh into the wilderness, green out of Egypt, God says this to them concerning the manna and how to order themselves: 'This shall be when the Lord shall give you in the evening flesh to eat'. In the evening flesh to eat. And in the morning bread to the full. In the evening flesh to eat and in the morning bread to the full. {More scripture reference about meal times. 1 Kings 7:6} '...morning and evening with flesh and bread to eat...' Luke 17, look at verse 7 and 8. This word...supper...These are two different words in the English language, they're two different words. And the Greek and the Hebrew. And they mean two different things. '...go and sit down to meat and will not say unto him, make ready that I may sup and gird thyself...' At the end of the day, a meal called 'supper'.  Ecclesiates verse 10, 16 says 'Woe unto you when your princes feast in the morning'. Was a lighter meal. This meal in the beginning of the day, as opposed to this meal at the end of the day... 'After the same manner also he took the cup, when he had supped, saying, This cup is the new testament in my blood, this do ye, as oft as ye drink, in remembrance of me.'   Luke chapter 14, verses 16 and 17. ...This is the parable of the Great Supper. The parable of the Great Supper. It's different. From Matthew chapter 22. This is a dinner.

My question to you, brethren. I want you to ask yourself, I want you to search your heart. Are you behaving the household of God. {With more emphasis} Are you behaving your self in the household of God, do you know how to behave the household of God.
The difference between the dinner and the supper, the difference between the dinner of Matthew 22 in this parable we will look at, and the difference between the supper in the parable that we'll also look at in Luke chapter 14, is a world of difference. A world of difference. One is a trial, of things. And one is a consummation of all things. And if you get in one, brethren, blessed are ye. That are called. To the marriage supper of the lamb. Blessed are ye. That are called. So beware, because many are called to the marriage dinner of the lamb, few are chosen. But blessed are ye if called. To the marriage supper of the lamb. Hebrews chapter 12.

Do you remember where we are? Do you know that this house, great house, wherein we dwell right now. This great house called by the name of our God. Do you know that in this great house, God has the perogative as the King, and as the householder, the head of this house, that He has the perogative to purge vessels from this house, that are dishonorable vessels! He has the perogative to purge them out! Verse 18. For ye are not come unto the mount that might be touched, and that burned with fire, nor unto blackness, and darkness, and tempest, and the sound of a trumpet, and the voice of words; which voice they that heard intreated that the word should not be spoken to them any more. For they could not endure that which was commanded, and if so much as a beast touch the mountain, it shall be stoned, or thrust through with a dart! And so terrible...sooo terrible... was the sight, that Moses, the man of God. Moses said... I...exceedingly fear and quake!  {Really shouting now, worked up} I...who have stood in the burning light of God, Holy presence...I...I exceedingly fear and quake! And God in this tremendous book of Hebrews, wherein exalted the greatness of our covenant, set over against the covenant of old, the covenant established at the hand of angels, the covenant established at the hand of that mighty man of God, the foreshadowing man...of Jesus Christ. Moses. This so much greater covenant! This tremendous book wherein God is exalting the greatness of our covenant. Over against the greatness of the covenant of old.

And they bring us here to these mountains. The apostle and his wisdom. All wisdom. By the spirit of God. Consummates this great chief book of the New Testament. And he brings us to the base of two mountains. And He says you have come to this mountain! This terrifying mountain! So terrible was the sight that Moses, a man of God, said I exceedingly fear and quake! I!  Paul says you have come unto Mount Zion. And unto the city of the living God. And unto the heavenly Jerusalem. And to an innumerable company of angels! Dreadful angels! At the sight of which, men in their flesh and earthen vessel have fallen down as though dead! Just beholding the sight of such fearful dreadful beings! Have been brought to become an assembly of God! Such terrible figures. To the general assembly and Church of the Firstborn...which are writ in heaven with all their high and heavenly privileges and the God, the judge of all {difficult to understand here}. And to the spirits of just men made perfect! And to Jesus. The mediator of the new covenant and to the blood of sprinkling that speaketh better things, than that of Abel. See that you refuse not him that speaketh! For they escape not who refused Him and spake of much more! Much more shall not we escape if we turn away from Him that speaketh from heaven! 

Do you remember the judgements. Do you remember the executions. When a man transgresses against the word communicated by that holy man of God, Moses. How by one transgression out of the mouth of two or three witnesses, this thing was established, this transgression was established and they searched it and they diligently saw and the thing was certain, that was done. Do you remember what happened. Do you remember how certainly the execution was brought on? Do you remember how swiftly...and what speed...that man's judgement came upon his head. Do you remember. That was when a man refused. A man. The word of a man speaking on Earth. See that you refuse him not. Brethren.  

He's speaking from heaven. Whose voice then shook the earth. But now, He hath promised pain yet once more. Take not the earth only, but also the heaven! And brethren, Christ came preaching about a kingdom. He came preaching innumerable sermons. Volumes of books that wouldn't fill the earth. If libraries were made, all about the kingdom of heaven. Which this mediator of the new and better covenant came to establish. The kingdom of Heaven on Earth. {With emphasis}  It's this, right now. It's this. Where we are right now. This is it. The kingdom of Heaven. This is not an earthly kingdom! This is an heavenly kingdom. That you're in. Right now.  

In this word, yet once more, signifyeth the removing of those things that are shaken. And the things that are made. Things that cannot be shaken may remain. Wherefore we recieving a kingdom which cannot be moved, let us have grace! Let us have grace whereby we may serve God acceptably with reverance and Godly fear. Godly fear, Brethren! How dreadful is this place. Godly fear. Reverance. Godly fear. We need grace! To serve Him and worship Him acceptable in this house. With reverance and Godly fear, Brethren, right now God is shaking. Not only the earth but the heavens also. And everything that can be shaken, will be shaken and only those things which remain will be left. At the end of the day. At the end of this dinner, when God calls us to His Heavenly Supper of the lamb. Will you be there? For many are called, but few are chosen.

He goes on quite a bit longer; a couple of hours. Church of Wells is one of the seven golden lampstands. Jesus walks among them. Not sure I quite got that part about the general assembly and Church of the Firstborn. Sounds like he's addressing 'the brethren' as that. 
What is the important distinction between 'dinner' and 'supper'? What judgements and executions? For refusing what? Whew, he is mad! Sounds like the congregation is slipping. Jake lectures about abiding. Going the distance. Says "just stay with it" several times. The expectation of the Righteous shall. not. be. cut off!  

At the end he says:

...Your life will be pleasing. Sweet smelling savor to the Father as you walk in Christ. That is most precious garment of all. It is the righteousness of Christ. Oh to be found in Him. Having no righteousness of my own. Not that which is of the law. But that which is by the faith. Of Jesus Christ. Would you forsake everything, Brethren? Would you forsake it all again? Would you right now in your heart forsake it all? Paul said I forsook everything to win. And I do presently count it all but dumb. That I might win Him. Know Him. Be found in Him. Not having my own righteousness which is of the law, but that which is by the faith of Jesus Christ. So, this walk, this worthiness which is us keeping our garments... it's abiding in Him. Merely. Simply. Abiding in Christ. Simply keeping that confession which ... back in the beginning when you were worthy in the eyes of God. And you hated your mother, father, sister, brethren, your own life. Everything that you could ever imagine if you had the time to sit down, imagining all these things that would be so precious to you. It's a no-brainer. On the altar. Hated it. You loved Christ. That's worthiness. They that have kept their garments, these are worthy in Christ's sense. These are worthy. Those are those that are chosen, out of this great and fearful dinner. When you're called to this dinner, if you are chosen. Many are seen right now in the church of God, the Elect, the Elect of God right now. Many are seen. Right here. Few are chosen. 

Our hope is this. It's a fearful dinner. Because the stakes right now are eternal. Things that are bearing upon us are the utmost consequence and weight. Should be dealt with with the utmost gravity. And concern. They have everything to do with our souls. The eternal state thereof. Revelation chapter 19: "The marriage supper of the lamb." That's our hope. We're going somewhere, Brethren. After this rehearsal is finished. After this great preparation is finished and we've learned how to behave ourselves in the house of God. And God takes away the patterns and the figures. God takes away all shadows and all ordinances and we are brought into the ... There is no more condescension, everything is done away with. And we see Him and know Him, even as we are known. Even as He now seeth us.

There be something written on the gate of heaven - 'He that passeth in these gates shall never come out again.' That's our hope, Brethren. That's our hope. How glorious, Brethren, in this world where we are sojourning strangers. In this world where we pass the time of our sojourning with fear! Remember who our God is. Remember this fear we must serve Him with. How blessed will it be, Brethren. There be no death. There be no cessation of the gracious influence of the spirit that are pouring out presently upon you as an ocean torrent falling upon your head, perpetually throughout the endless ages of eternity. And you'll never depart. You never would depart. You never will depart. You never could depart. Forever. In His image. Forever in His likeness. To shine like the angel, like the lights of heaven. Redeemed. Ransomed forever. Marriage supper of the lamb. The consummation of the ages, the end of all time. This is where we're going. 

Verses 7 through 9. {Thundering shouting} 'Let us be glad and rejoice and give honor to Him, for the marriage of the lamb has come and His wife hath made herself ready...'       So the fine linen is the righteousness of saints. And he sayeth unto me, 'Right'!  Right! This watchword before and behind, this word. Right! Be sure you dont miss what I'm about to say, Right! And afterwords, He said: 'These are the true saints of God.' What's He saying. RIGHT. Blessed are they which are called. Unto the marriage supper. Of the lamb. {Shouts} Blessed are they which are called. CALLED. Merely called! Not even chosen! But just CALLED! To the marriage supper of the lamb.

He said these saints, these are the true saints of God. Revelation chapter 3. Verse 12. 'He that overcometh...' He that overcometh. What is overcoming? Abiding in Christ. What's overcoming? This is the victory that overcometh the world. Even our faith. Even our faith and faith in Son of God. This is what overcometh the world. This is what has overcome the world. This is what will overcome the world and your flesh. Walk in Christ. You will not fulfil the lust of the flesh. You will be bold. You will be confident. You will hate 'til the day of judgement.

The issue of the important distinction between dinner and supper is confusing. He uses both words in the same context and application. Considering that it's the basis of the entire two hour semon, that makes it difficult to understand. When he uses the other word the same way, it must be intentional and meaningful? What does it mean? Or is he misspeaking himself? 

Members are off their game, aren't they? It sounds like the "saints" aren't abiding. Sounds like there's some dissension in the ranks.  


1/26/2015 6:54 pm  #24

Re: What they said...

"You will hate 'til the day of judgement." Wow.

Mark 12:31King James Version (KJV)

31 And the second is like, namely this, Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself. There is none other commandment greater than these.

How does this align with the hate?


1/26/2015 7:43 pm  #25

Re: What they said...

Maybe they'd like to show where this bit of "scriptural truth" came from?

At the end Jake references Revelation 3:12. This is the seven letters composed to the seven churches. Verse 12 is speaking to the Philadelphians. Starts at verse 7.

7 And to the angel of the church in Philadelphia write; These things saith he that is holy, he that is true, he that hath the key of David, he that openeth, and no man shutteth; and shutteth, and no man openeth;
8 I know thy works: behold, I have set before thee an open door, and no man can shut it: for thou hast a little strength, and hast kept my word, and hast not denied my name.
9 Behold, I will make them of the synagogue of Satan, which say they are Jews, and are not, but do lie; behold, I will make them to come and worship before thy feet, and to know that I have loved thee.
10 Because thou hast kept the word of my patience, I also will keep thee from the hour of temptation, which shall come upon all the world, to try them that dwell upon the earth.
11 Behold, I come quickly: hold that fast which thou hast, that no man take thy crown.
12 Him that overcometh will I make a pillar in the temple of my God, and he shall go no more out: and I will write upon him the name of my God, and the name of the city of my God, which is new Jerusalem, which cometh down out of heaven from my God: and I will write upon him my new name.
13 He that hath an ear, let him hear what the Spirit saith unto the churches.

What is the significance here for Church of Wells; to Sean, Ryan and Jake?

The Church at Philadelphia and the Key of David (Revelation 3:7-13)

In the book of Revelation, John used this Old Testament metaphor to get across a vital message to the church in Philadelphia, and thereby to all Christians. That is, Christ has the key of David. He opens the door for the church — his royal household — and allows it to come into the presence of God. In short, Christ has granted Christians access to God. No one can deprive them of that access, which means that God gives them salvation.

The key in Revelation does much more than open the way to talking with a national king. In Christ’s hand, the key opens the door into the presence of God, his kingdom and eternal life. Not only does Christ open the door, he is the door to the kingdom (John 10:79). Thus, it is Jesus who presents himself to the church as the way to salvation (John 14:6).

A second interpretation of the open door and key statements is that the open door set before the church was a wide-open opportunity to engage in evangelistic activity and preach the gospel. Paul used a similar metaphor in this manner (1 Corinthians 16:92 Corinthians 2:12Colossians 4:3).

However, Revelation usually uses imagery from the Old Testament, and the Old Testament background of the key and door metaphor works against this idea. The prophet Isaiah was speaking of access to the king, not evangelism to the world. The concept of access is also more in keeping with the context of Revelation. There is no evidence to support the interpretation of these passages as the church’s missionary activity.

The book of Revelation has a different purpose — that of providing much-needed encouragement and comfort during trying circumstances. It presents the church not as a soul-conquering body but as an organism fighting for its very life in a hostile world. That’s because the church was being intimidated by those who “claim to be Jews though they are not” (3:9). George Eldon Ladd explains the situation:

“The immediate background of the phrase was the claim of the Jews in Philadelphia that they were the true people of God who held the key to the Kingdom of God. John contradicts this claim by asserting that the key to the kingdom which had belonged to Israel really belongs to Jesus as the Davidic messiah (5:5; 22:16) and had been forfeited by Israel because she had rejected her Messiah” (A Commentary on the Revelation of John, p. 59).

These Jews will ultimately have to acknowledge that Christ loves the church. They will recognize that the church is composed of the true people of God, rather than the Jews as a nation. The Christians at Philadelphia would have been greatly encouraged when Christ identified himself as the true Messiah, and as one who controls access to the eternal kingdom. When he opens the door “no one can shut” it – and no one can prevent entry to the people for whom he opens it (3:7).

The local Jewish community of Philadelphia may claim that the kingdom belongs to the Jewish community. But they “are liars” (3:9). Christ has used the key of David to set an open door before the church, not the synagogue. The door to the synagogue may be closed to the Christian; the door to Christ’s heavenly kingdom is wide open.

But even as the church is persecuted — and its members martyred — it should remember the promises of its leader, Jesus Christ. He alone holds the key to God’s presence and has opened the door to his kingdom and the church’s salvation.

Paul Kroll (2013)© Grace Communion International


1/27/2015 8:00 pm  #26

Re: What they said...

Hythlodaeus wrote:

Jake: "a quick teaching. ...word study...on this word 'dinner'. The word supper is well in the scriptures. This word dinner...derivative thereof, dinner, dined, dine, is used approximately 8 times in the entire Bible." {Really? 8 times. Huh} "The word supper is used approximately 18 times in the entire Bible or derivative thereof. Supper, supped."

In just the first 30+ minutes and 10 minutes at the end, Jacob Gardener uses these words more times than the divinely-inspired authors used in the Bible.
Dinner and 'derivative thereof': 15
Supper and 'derivative thereof': 20

Interesting ~

Jake: "And if you get in one, brethren, blessed are ye. That are called. To the marriage supper of the lamb. Blessed are ye. That are called. So beware, because many are called to the marriage dinner of the lamb, few are chosen. But blessed are ye if called. To the marriage supper of the lamb. Hebrews chapter 12."

"The difference between a world of difference."

I don't understand the importance of the distinction between meal times and what it's called. Further, I really don't understand making such a distinction and then using the words interchangeably. Which is it - the dinner of the lamb or the supper of the lamb?


1/27/2015 11:19 pm  #27

Re: What they said...

The Beauty of Dying
Jacob Gardner

First 18 minutes. He says the words 'dying', 'death', and 'death' 31 times, mostly after the 13-minute mark. Refers to death on average once every 10 seconds (six times per minute) for five full minutes. 

Desire greatly. More than I know how to express. ....I believe I have a word from God. I was in the spirit on the Lord's Day as though I heard a mighty voice behind me speaking. Thrilled my heart. Overflowed my unworthy soul with thanksgiving. Desire to speak that to you now. That we might more ably offer the sacrifice of praise and thanksgiving in this Charity Feast before the Lord. Turn to Eclessiatics 3, Brethren. Wanna speak to you a little bit about dying. Lord communicated this word to me in a very unique way. As in a moment, suddenly, a word just bursted upon my heart. This afternoon I wasn't planning to speak. Planning to preach to you. But when the Lord God speaks, who can forebear to prophecize. God knows I'm not a prophet. God knows I'm not the son of a prophet. God has spoken His word to my heart. I just desire you to hear, hear this word, Brethren.

So amazed this afternoon as I was praying, I been walking a lot, praying a lot, outside. As I had suspected a couple months, ago like I told you all, as we just moved into our home. The night just before the Brockingtons arrived at the Charity Feast as I was exhorting you on the necessity of meditation, and we had just moved into our house there, and I believe that the Lord was calling me away. From the close study. A little bit. And a little bit deeper into meditation. So, consequently I didn't have this good study or even a good place really at all in the house to study there. But there's a good field to go and meditate in. So I took a hint and since then I've been meditating, musing much more. Hiding myself much more. Just out in the wilderness a little bit more. And I've been so thankful for the time. So I was out today praying. And I'm not sure if it was just because the sun was shining a little bit brighter than it had been these past days. But at one point I just looked up and saw the trees were all yellow and brown and red. Everything but green. And it just rejoiced my heart and I just saw the beauty of it. And I'm not a pantheist. I don't go to climb mountains and worship them. Lord knows. But I believe God wants to instruct us by these things. I believe he wants us to be near to His heart. I believe He wants us to be easily instructed in as many ways, as many outlets. Speak to us through our wives and through our children. Through the circumstances of life. Through the name. The time. Of our children. Through nature. I believe God desires to speak to us and I believe that He would speak to us, and when God comes, I don't want to be giving way to the devil, I don't want to be given overly to enthusiasm or searching too far into things that aren't actually there. But I know one thing, Brethren, it's when God comes. When God steps down from heaven, everything changes. Everything changes. The ticking of the clock. The greenness of the grass. The blueness of the sky. Everything changes. That night when God steps down from heaven, at the end of that dispensation and the days of Eli, when God was putting away this dispensation...waxed old as a garment and God was doing away with it and He was changing face. When God stepped down that night in the temple of God! When Eli was lying down to sleep and his eyes began to wax dim! And e're...the candle in the house of the Lord had gone out. And Samuel was laid down in his place sleep. The Lord spoke to Samuel. Brethren, everything means something that night. Everything means something. Everything. The common things of life! The ordinary things become extraordinary. Those things where God generally was not speaking by. Take on a new significance. When seen in the spirit. 
And I just lifted up my eyes and I saw the red, the yellow, the brown, the trees. And rejoicing entered into my heart, Brethren. A rejoicing in God entered into my heart. And I just praised the Lord for His beauty. For His beauty. I saw something beautiful in this. And my question is, Brethren - how is it we can look upon a tree that has turned yellow or brown...and it's not beautiful to us. But it's ugly. Distasteful. {gettin' worked up} It looks like it needs to be cut down, needs to be taken out of this scene {shouting now}, it's just rending the beautiful scene before our eyes! {Is he mad?}  Lackluster. But then you can drive over some ridge. Descend into some valley and the explosion {!}, the FIRE {!!!} of RED, BROWN and YELLOW and ORANGE {bellows} before-your-eyes {poetic glissade} RAVISHES your heart {screaming} and you're overcome by the beauty of it! And it's beautiful to you...

What's the difference? What's the difference between this ugly tree rending the beautiful scene of green with it's brown and yellow? What's different between that and this valley on fire with the red and yellow and orange of dying trees? There's something dying in those trees. There's something dying in those trees that I saw today. Yes, there's something dying in this other tree as well, what's the difference? {calm and thoughtful} What makes this one soo distasteful? {purposeful now} So WRONG {loud} and this one so right, so beautiful? {plaintive now} Ravishes your heart. What's the difference? This one is dead when it should be alive. This one is dead when it should be dying. That's the difference, friends. The timing makes all the difference. 
And I wondered what the Lord was saying through this. I was puzzled, it was like some proverb had said itself before my eyes and I didn't understand and I just inclined in my heart, I asked the Lord, what's it mean. The Lord led me to Eclesiates 3. Read these first, twelve verses.
"To everything there is a season...{etc., recites poetically} be exercised in it."  To. be. exercised. in. it. {raps sharply on pulpit}  What sorrow of ourn, what travail, what DEATH! To be exercised in. He hath made everything beautiful in - His - time! {claps on each word for emphasis}. In His time. Also He has set the world in their heart. So that no man can find out the work that God maketh from the beginning. To the end.

To everything there is a season. There's a time, there's a time to live and there's a time to die. You view these from verse 2 to verse 8. We would desire some happy peaceful calm meaning but there's not. One extreme here and another extreme there, that's what God has given to you. He's given you a time to DIE and a time to live. He's given you a time to laugh and a time to mourn. WE. You see that. The poles. That's what God has given you. You know what God wants to do in it, He wants to exercise us. He wants us to learn to die. He wants us to learn to live. Many of you, Brethren, I imagine like myself, lust after being an evergreen when God says 'no'. No. There's a time you've gotta cast your fruit. There's a time...and God's gonna teach it to you. {whispering} There's a time to die. There's a time when God wants to put you on the shelf. {getting louder} And He wants you to learn to die.

Brethren, what God is speaking to my heart and what I believe He wants us all to know is that there is a beauty in brokenness. There's a BEAUTY, there is something of LUSTER that our hearts should be inclined to - a LUST after this DYING! DIE! Brethren {claps}, to die. God is trying to speak something to you. When your heart is ravished by this congregation of dead plants. Believe God wants us to learn this lesson. Believe He wants us to learn the beauty of it. I believe He wants us to learn to be present and to be exercised by it, that's what it is. When you are being exercised by these DEATHS - 10,000 deaths - on the way to death. God has given as the lot of a true Christian. To die, Brethren, when you're dying on a cross, you're not just dead. A man on a cross which is what you have been called to, is not just death, Brethren, but its dying. Dy-ing. DYING.

How shameful. What a reproach. How wanting of all glory is a man dying on a cross! {shouting} What a sweet release just to dissolve into death! When you're on a cross. There's a time when you can tell all your bones and they've all been disjointed and you can see them at your feet. Parting your garments and casting something something, the bulls of Bashan surrounding you! The dogs barking around you! Everyone wagging their hand at you! {screaming} And you have no rights. {soft sotto voce} You have no words to say. You've been winded. Behold your calling. As a Christian. Not just death, but dying. Dying. That's the beautiful part. When I saw those trees they weren't dead, they're dying. There's some part of them that's dying. {getting cranked up again} It's beautiful. And Brethren, there's a time to bring forth fruit and there's a time to cast our fruit. You'll be like a tree. Planted by the rivers of water which bringeth forth His fruits in His season. In His season. Whatsoever you shall do you shall prosper. Have you taken account of this. Spiritually. In your walk with God have you taken account of this, have you been very careful to glory and to be exercised in this.


1/28/2015 12:46 am  #28

Re: What they said...

This is quit disturbing...even more than the last one. It seems like he is on drugs!

Last edited by 4everfaithful (1/28/2015 12:51 am)


1/28/2015 7:28 am  #29

Re: What they said...

This sermon is so disturbing! I feel so helpless.  Should we report this death sermon/threat to the authorities?  Would they care?  At the very least, should we notify Child Protective Services?  Is Jake's sermon not a threat to the safety and well being of the men, woman and children living in the CoW??  


1/28/2015 12:58 pm  #30

Re: What they said...

I believe there is good reason for concern. It is obvious that Jake and the other "elders" of the CofW hold the charismatic teaching that God is still speaking directly to people apart and aside from the complete canon of Scripture. He believes that God is either speaking to him and the other "elders" of the CofW audibly or through a voice they hear in their heads. When this teaching is truly accepted, the door is open for Satan to speak to individuals under the guise of the Holy Spirit, either audibly or through a voice they hear in their head. It is a dangerous teaching, and very deceptive. If they believe that God is speaking to them when it is actually Satan (or demons) speaking, it is possible to be led into much perversion of truth, and possibly actions which would be shocking. See 2 Corinthians 11:13-15.


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This is a conversation, an open dialogue, in the tradition of Free Speech. The purpose is to promote independent investigation, public debate and dialogue on cult and mind control issues critical to our social and individual well-being. Statements made reflect the writer's opinion. This forum acts to provide a space for electronic medium of information transfer, with the explicit understanding that each user will independently evaluate it and carefully make up his or her own mind as to its factual accuracy and usefulness. Independent individuals, organizations, authors, researchers, academicians and contributors may be exercising constitutional rights of petition, free speech, participation in government, or freedom of religion in researching, evaluating and freely discussing any matter. These discussions or statements may be constitutionally-protected opinions, speculation, allegations, satire, fiction, or religious beliefs or religious opinions of independent individuals, organizations or authors and as such, may or may not be factual.